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Patriotsguy
Thursday, June 26th, 2008, 12:15 PM
By MARK SHERMAN, Associated Press Writer 10 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that Americans have a right to own guns for self-defense and hunting, the justices' first major pronouncement on gun rights in U.S. history.

The court's 5-4 ruling struck down the District of Columbia's 32-year-old ban on handguns as incompatible with gun rights under the Second Amendment. The decision went further than even the Bush administration wanted, but probably leaves most firearms laws intact.

The court had not conclusively interpreted the Second Amendment since its ratification in 1791. The amendment reads: "A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

The basic issue for the justices was whether the amendment protects an individual's right to own guns no matter what, or whether that right is somehow tied to service in a state militia.

Writing for the majority, Justice Antonin Scalia said that an individual right to bear arms is supported by "the historical narrative" both before and after the Second Amendment was adopted.

The Constitution does not permit "the absolute prohibition of handguns held and used for self-defense in the home," Scalia said. The court also struck down Washington's requirement that firearms be equipped with trigger locks.

In a dissent he summarized from the bench, Justice John Paul Stevens wrote that the majority "would have us believe that over 200 years ago, the Framers made a choice to limit the tools available to elected officials wishing to regulate civilian uses of weapons."

He said such evidence "is nowhere to be found."

Justice Stephen Breyer wrote a separate dissent in which he said, "In my view, there simply is no untouchable constitutional right guaranteed by the Second Amendment to keep loaded handguns in the house in crime-ridden urban areas."

Joining Scalia were Chief Justice John Roberts and Justices Samuel Alito, Anthony Kennedy and Clarence Thomas. The other dissenters were Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg and David Souter.

The capital's gun law was among the nation's strictest.

Dick Anthony Heller, 66, an armed security guard, sued the District after it rejected his application to keep a handgun at his home for protection in the same Capitol Hill neighborhood as the court.

The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia ruled in Heller's favor and struck down Washington's handgun ban, saying the Constitution guarantees Americans the right to own guns and that a total prohibition on handguns is not compatible with that right.

The issue caused a split within the Bush administration. Vice President Dick Cheney supported the appeals court ruling, but others in the administration feared it could lead to the undoing of other gun regulations, including a federal law restricting sales of machine guns. Other laws keep felons from buying guns and provide for an instant background check.
Scalia said nothing in Thursday's ruling should "cast doubt on long-standing prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons or the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings."

The law adopted by Washington's city council in 1976 bars residents from owning handguns unless they had one before the law took effect. Shotguns and rifles may be kept in homes, if they are registered, kept unloaded and either disassembled or equipped with trigger locks.
Opponents of the law have said it prevents residents from defending themselves. The Washington government says no one would be prosecuted for a gun law violation in cases of self-defense.


Source (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080626/ap_on_go_su_co/scotus_guns)

SeLvesTr
Thursday, June 26th, 2008, 02:48 PM
Great! This is what the TXCDL (http://opencubicle.net/content/2008/06/23/texas-is-gunning-for-trouble/) want to hear as they were petitioning the governor and the state of Texas to allow Texas citizens to carry firearms in plain sight.

Kaos
Monday, June 30th, 2008, 10:20 AM
When I lived in Utah I remember this big deal about not being able to carry guns into courthouses anymore, but the courthouses would provide a place for you to store your gun, just outside the actual courtroom. I thought it was crazy but they have always been a big gun carrying state. Used to make me uneasy personaly, going to buy groceries literally surrounded by people packing heat!!

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0510/p03s01-usju.html

SeLvesTr
Monday, June 30th, 2008, 11:24 AM
When I lived in Utah I remember this big deal about not being able to carry guns into courthouses anymore, but the courthouses would provide a place for you to store your gun, just outside the actual courtroom. I thought it was crazy but they have always been a big gun carrying state. Used to make me uneasy personaly, going to buy groceries literally surrounded by people packing heat!!

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0510/p03s01-usju.html:) Was it anywhere near Ogden by chance? Heard a shotgun carrying man got shot there by cops.

Kaos
Monday, June 30th, 2008, 11:29 AM
Ummm. it could have been I can't recall if the whole thing was for Salt Lake County or statewide. I was just beside myself when people were actually fighting they had a right to have their guns in the court room.

"Yeah, good idea to let people have guns during their family/friends sentencing in there!" Those people amazed me!

SeLvesTr
Monday, June 30th, 2008, 05:15 PM
Ah! Okay. I hadn't read the full article as yet. Had only bookmark it for later. That was funny tho.

Raven
Monday, June 30th, 2008, 07:08 PM
I remember when I lived in California was grocery shopping with this girl. I was 17 years old (married YES STUPID) and when she was getting her money out of her person I seen a pistol. I am thinking wholy shit, I barely know this girl accept that her husband worked with my ex and here she is packing a pistol. Then she ask if I wanted her to steal something for me. I am like UH, NO, if I can't afford it, I don't want it. :eek:

When I lived in Utah I remember this big deal about not being able to carry guns into courthouses anymore, but the courthouses would provide a place for you to store your gun, just outside the actual courtroom. I thought it was crazy but they have always been a big gun carrying state. Used to make me uneasy personaly, going to buy groceries literally surrounded by people packing heat!!

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0510/p03s01-usju.html

esnagel
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 09:28 AM
It'd be easier if we just had a ban on guns; but because we don't, it causes more and more people to buy guns for "self-defense".

Watch Bowling For Columbine (http://www.michaelmoore.com/books-films/bowlingforcolumbine/) for a thought-provoking film on gun control.

Kaos
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 10:12 AM
Yes, we have to defend ourselves from every other dumbie out there who somehow got a gun permit. What a logical country we have!

THERESA
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 10:57 AM
The problem I see with allowing people to carry guns is the fact that it's the crazy nut jobs that will have them. Sure they can get their hands on them anyways but it makes it easier. It's not the sane normal people that run out to buy them.

I would rather people carry them in plain site though rather than concealed. That way you know who has them and who not to piss off over whose turn it is in line at the grocery store. :frog:

Westchesterguy
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 11:30 AM
Esnagel, " It would be easier if we just banned guns" Are you naive or just stupid. The notion of banning guns is foolish. The only people who obey gun laws are the law abiding. Crooks don't obey laws. The Gov't banned drugs ie pot, coke etc. and that is available everywhere. Wake up and get your head out of the sand ;)

Kaos
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 11:57 AM
I agree with ensnagle though. I hate guns, there is no reason for any of them IMHO. Obviously there are issues but I am a true believer that the "right to bear arms" is totally taken out of perspective as far as normal citizens should all have all the guns they want.

esnagel
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 12:25 PM
Wow, looks like we found the president of our local chapter of the NRA.

Our right to bear arms makes sense - if this is the 18th century. In the city of Buffalo, there is no reason for any civilian to be armed. Canada is not going to attack. We don't have Mountain Lions lurking in dark alleys.

A complete ban on guns would make things very easy on law officials. If you have a gun, you're breaking the law. None of this BS of citing the constitution. Guns are just plain stupid.

However, I know guns will never be banned. People need guns to hunt (because, you know, there's not enough food in grocery stores and they'd rather have a decapitated deer head decorating their living room rather than a painting or photo of their family), then someone steals their gun and kills someone else, then their neighbors buy guns to "protect themselves" and their kid ends up bringing the gun to school to show their friends.

Whatever, this argument will go nowhere. Perhaps banning guns isn't the answer; other countries allow their citizens to own guns and they don't go around killing each other. I don't know what we need to do to get Americans to act responsibly again, rather than leeching off the few that are truly honorable.

Ideally they'd take care of this themselves with all the guns out there, but this is turning out to be a slow process.

Kaos
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 12:50 PM
I think it sadly comes down to American Greed and belief that we can do anything..worst case (as mentioned elsewhere) is 3 straight meals a day and no more mortgage payments...What a punishment!
Think about it, people rob because they want things they don't have. So maybe if we could get rid of American greed and laziness...we'd have a better society again. We really have gone so far of the deep end in our country

THERESA
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 12:54 PM
Esnagel, " It would be easier if we just banned guns" Are you naive or just stupid. The notion of banning guns is foolish. The only people who obey gun laws are the law abiding. Crooks don't obey laws. The Gov't banned drugs ie pot, coke etc. and that is available everywhere. Wake up and get your head out of the sand ;)

Surely there was a kinder way to word this.

Rebecky
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 02:27 PM
However, I know guns will never be banned. People need guns to hunt (because, you know, there's not enough food in grocery stores and they'd rather have a decapitated deer head decorating their living room rather than a painting or photo of their family),
My husband hunts. When he does shoot something, we usually pay a $50 deer processing fee and end up with a freezer full of tenderloins, steaks, and ground meat enough for at least 6-8 months. It's been a while though...lol. I would rather spend the $50 once for that amount of food, than $50/week at the grocery store.
He does not hunt for trophies. I think that's just gross...:(
Whatever, this argument will go nowhere..
I agree...

SeLvesTr
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 02:34 PM
Surely there was a kinder way to word this.It is like you read my mind. I guess all mods think alike. ;)

THERESA
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 02:45 PM
My husband hunts. When he does shoot something, we usually pay a $50 deer processing fee and end up with a freezer full of tenderloins, steaks, and ground meat enough for at least 6-8 months. It's been a while though...lol. I would rather spend the $50 once for that amount of food, than $50/week at the grocery store.
He does not hunt for trophies. I think that's just gross...:(

I agree...

My brother has always been strapped for money and did the same thing. His family always ate what he hunted and he didn't hunt for sport. If people are feeding their families, I see nothing wrong with it. Hunting for sport is cruel.

esnagel
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 04:09 PM
OK - hunting for food versus hunting for "game" are 2 different things. I was a bit heated when I replied - I should've just left it 'til tomorrow.

Although I did read today that Half of gun deaths are suicides (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080630/ap_on_re_us/gun_deaths_suicide). Interesting article full of facts that I'm not sure I really want to talk about.

Kaos
Tuesday, July 1st, 2008, 04:59 PM
^ Oddly enough even suicide is a crime! My step-Grandfather committed suicide and if it was painful enough to have that happen, the house was swarming with police and a full investigation when everything was obvious it was a suicide (I leave out the details to spare you all)

If we can start hunting cows then I'm up for hunting! Not a big venison fan, but my Dad dd that too growing up hunting for food. But fill my freezer with hamburger and steaks and I'm in, especially with grocery prices these days!

SeLvesTr
Wednesday, July 2nd, 2008, 06:22 AM
OK - hunting for food versus hunting for "game" are 2 different things. I was a bit heated when I replied - I should've just left it 'til tomorrow.

Although I did read today that Half of gun deaths are suicides (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080630/ap_on_re_us/gun_deaths_suicide). Interesting article full of facts that I'm not sure I really want to talk about.Interesting read.